Sinusitis FAQ » Sinusitis Causes

strange feeling in sinuses???

admin — Fri, 25 Jun 2004 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

i’m hoping people on this forum can help me. i’m not sure why i put this in sleep disorders, but i guess this condition flares up alot when i sleep. i have a strange feeling in my nasal passages, sort of like it’s very dry and irritated or that some of the nodes (is that the correct word? have become agitated. almost always one side of throat/nose only, but occasionally other side too. IT REALLY FEELS LIKE IT’S IN THE RIGHT HAND PASSAGE WAY FROM THROAT TO NOSE, BUT WHEN I CLEAR IT BY SMALL COUGH, IT FEELS LIKE IT MIGHT BE FURTHER DOWN. when to a throat specialist a year ago and he didn’t find anything but i think i described it more as a lump, so he’d probably have been looking for something very serious and right now i’d classify this as very annoying. My thoughts are that its a combination of 1) dehydration (flares up when i run, but it definitely feels like it’s localized in one spot). 2) allergies (i’m pretty much allergic to all common non-food allergents; started on allergy shots a year ago, but i find it’s very time-consuming and not effective). basically, this condition started when i lived in a house with horrible ventilation and alot of mold, plus i’m not great at cleaning so alot of dust, but that’s nothing new. 3) stress (i notice it when i feel stressed or go to important meetings). other possible causes: could be a small little growth or irritated nodes (never even realized that just behind mouth, there are these passages (i assume to the nose). the condition comes and goes a little. could something very small (mold or fingernail piece – chew my nails) impacted although i think my body would be trying to expel it violently. I have very little mucus in nose/throat/saliva and noticed that for years (when i was a kid i had alot due to allergies or winter weather and had huge mucus)… could it be sinusitis??? but i’m never sick/cough (sinusitis caused terrible cough???) and i’ve got to figure a throat specialist would have checked for that. also, acid backing up from stomach????? Sorry to be hypochondriac but i’ve seen all these explanations on this thread. i’m sure most people, including that throat specialist if i go again, will tell me it’s a common condition of modern "poor air quality" and stress AND suggest hydrating nose more and taking antihistamines…. but i’d much rather take a pill and be cured LOL!!!! anyhow, thanks in advance for all input.

Response:

On 25 Jun 2004 09:41:31 -0700, smchan…@yahoo.com (go raptors!) wrote: >i have a strange feeling in my nasal passages, sort of like it’s very >dry and irritated or that some of the nodes (is that the correct word? >have become agitated. almost always one side of throat/nose only, but >occasionally other side too. IT REALLY FEELS LIKE IT’S IN THE RIGHT >HAND PASSAGE WAY FROM THROAT TO NOSE, BUT WHEN I CLEAR IT BY SMALL >COUGH, IT FEELS LIKE IT MIGHT BE FURTHER DOWN.

That’s not really where the sinuses are. Well, I think there is one drainage point from the deep sphenoid sinus that goes somewhat low like that. If you want to be sure, you could get a CT scan. But if your sinuses look ok to the endoscope, it may not be justified to expose yourself to the radiation and cost of a CT scan, particlarly when the symptoms do not sound like sinus symptoms…..

Response:

First post

admin — Wed, 24 Dec 2003 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

I haven’t tried the pop-rivit idea. Sounds like a winner. I have my blower on a bookcase/headboard. The hose runs down the back of the headboard, then back up and over the top so it hits "me" from the top. (Basically the same as your clothes hanger.) I know some people have used bungee cord to suspend the hoses from a hook in the ceiling or high up on the wall. There have been some design changes on the hose guide over the years. At least three models. I’m using the second model and I’ve got a Breeze with the most recent (?) in the drawer. Funny thing with my insurance. They won’t pay for parts but will pay for a whole new Breeze. When I feel guilty I buy the part. ($22 at cpapman.com, last I checked). When I’m feeling ornery (and if six months has gone by) I buy a whole new one. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb. No wonder our insurance is in such a mess. Paul R "Nobody here" wrote in message

news:lMWGb.661704$Tr4.1665912@attbi_s03… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Thanks Paul. > I have been playing around with adjustments and positions. I have hit on a > perfect > solution to the pulling of the hose. I attached a heavy wire coat hanger to > the head > of the bed with a "hook" on the end. This way, the hose stays up in the air > instead > of being pulled when I roll over. > The other solution is with Breeze, the hose guide breaks very easily. When > I got a > replacement, I took a piece of metal, fairly rigid, bent it to the shape and > curve of the > hose guide and using a pop rivit tool, attached it to the underside of the > guide. Now, > no more breaking. That saves $30.00 every month because of the cheap > plastic > they use. Last night, no pulling of the hose and no slippage. Slept like a > baby. > Nobody here > > Try taking some time to play with *all* of the Breeze adjustments. Esp. > the > > angle between the plenum shell and the tang that holds the shell to the > hose > > guide. You might try stuffing a spacer under between the hose and the > tang > > to "set" the angle without having to use excessive pressure on the > > screw-clamp. My guess is that you’ll find a few combinations of the > > adjustments which will be comfortable (reasonably) leak-free and stable. > > Keep at it. > > Paul R

Response:

Thanks Paul. I have been playing around with adjustments and positions. I have hit on a perfect solution to the pulling of the hose. I attached a heavy wire coat hanger to the head of the bed with a "hook" on the end. This way, the hose stays up in the air instead of being pulled when I roll over. The other solution is with Breeze, the hose guide breaks very easily. When I got a replacement, I took a piece of metal, fairly rigid, bent it to the shape and curve of the hose guide and using a pop rivit tool, attached it to the underside of the guide. Now, no more breaking. That saves $30.00 every month because of the cheap plastic they use. Last night, no pulling of the hose and no slippage. Slept like a baby. Nobody here – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Try taking some time to play with *all* of the Breeze adjustments. Esp. the > angle between the plenum shell and the tang that holds the shell to the hose > guide. You might try stuffing a spacer under between the hose and the tang > to "set" the angle without having to use excessive pressure on the > screw-clamp. My guess is that you’ll find a few combinations of the > adjustments which will be comfortable (reasonably) leak-free and stable. > Keep at it. > Paul R

Response:

"Nobody here" wrote in message

news:tpDGb.457096$Dw6.1369499@attbi_s02… > Hi Glenn. > I would listen to what Charles and Buddy T had to say. I have a similar > situation as yours. I had the deviated septum surgery 2 years ago. It > worked for me. The doctor said it should work for most people. Other > surgery, in my opinion is a no no. I have been using a cpap for about 6 > months now and it works well for me. I am sleeping almost the entire night. > Unfortunately, the mask (Breeze w/nasal pillows) slips off from time to time > and it wakes me up. Other than that, no complaints.

Try taking some time to play with *all* of the Breeze adjustments. Esp. the angle between the plenum shell and the tang that holds the shell to the hose guide. You might try stuffing a spacer under between the hose and the tang to "set" the angle without having to use excessive pressure on the screw-clamp. My guess is that you’ll find a few combinations of the adjustments which will be comfortable (reasonably) leak-free and stable. Keep at it. Paul R

Response:

Hi Glenn. I would listen to what Charles and Buddy T had to say. I have a similar situation as yours. I had the deviated septum surgery 2 years ago. It worked for me. The doctor said it should work for most people. Other surgery, in my opinion is a no no. I have been using a cpap for about 6 months now and it works well for me. I am sleeping almost the entire night. Unfortunately, the mask (Breeze w/nasal pillows) slips off from time to time and it wakes me up. Other than that, no complaints. As the others have recommended, stay away from the other types of surgery. Nobody here in New Hampshire "Glenn" wrote in message

news:Xns945BB8424CF33glenn29aolcom@24.168.128.86… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Hi all, > I’ve been reading all of your comments and stories and I’m very glad I > found this newgroup. > I’m 36 male, overweight but no obese and suffer from severe OSA (about > 60-80 times an hour). Unfortunatly I’ve had no success with the CPAP to > date. I do keep trying as I know it’s the best way to get myself some > rest. My problems are these….I have severe nasal breathing problems > so I can’t seem to get enough air with my mouth closed…however, when I > try sleeping with my mouth open I get such bad post nasal drip that I > start choking. > I’ve seen a pulmonologist who has sent me to an ENT. He started me on > two different nose sprays which seem to clear me up a bit but I still > have the same problems at night. It’s been 3 months and I just recently > saw him again. > He is now suggesting surgery to fix my septum (sp) and clear my > breathing thru my nose. He is also going to remove my Uvula(sp). He > isn’t going to do the big surgery where soft tissue is removed and so > on. I feel pretty confident in this doctor and he seems generally > worried about allowing my sleep apnea to continue going untreated. > Does anybody have any comments about this procedure…or stories about > similar procedures they know about. > thanks, > Glenn

Response:

Glenn, Your story and mine are very similar and parallel, altho I am older than you. Please take to heart what Charles has posted to you. The throat surgery is probably a very, very bad idea. The clearing of the nasal passage is probably a good idea, if there actually is a fixable obstruction… such as a deviated septum, or other obvious obstructions. In any case, many doctors.. if not most…gain your confidence just to get payback for their education with surgery for insurance money – their only source of income. They do not care about you, in the final analysis, they care only about their yachts and car payments. Don’t ever forget where their minds and motives are. There are very few reasons to doubt this, when you deal with them long enough to see how they actually are. Forget the bedside manner…it’s a slick sales pitch so the doc can make his score… even if bad for you. With a clear nasal passage, the XPAP will work, while you work on a real cure. Lose weight, exercise for over-all health, and hope for the best. Once you let them whack – there is no going back! I have both a deviated septum, and now, severe sinusitis, so my CPAP is not doing the job… I am mouth breathing, and losing the pressure from the CPAP. All this runs up the old BP and causes me to feel like crap all the time. And all because of two things: deviated septum and overweight, with fat built up in the throat. But I guarantee, from my research on the throat surgery, no doc is going to use me for a big car payment… unless I finally decide to go for the septum surgery, which these days usually has good result. Best of luck. Research the operations. If you do, you will choose only one, the septum surgery. BuddyT PS Watch out for posts by people in the medical field who are committed to their field….doctors and procedures. Some of them are as bad as the docs. It’s their living, you know. "Glenn" wrote in message

news:Xns945BB8424CF33glenn29aolcom@24.168.128.86… Hi all, I’ve been reading all of your comments and stories and I’m very glad I found this newgroup. I’m 36 male, overweight but no obese and suffer from severe OSA (about 60-80 times an hour). Unfortunatly I’ve had no success with the CPAP to date. I do keep trying as I know it’s the best way to get myself some rest. My problems are these….I have severe nasal breathing problems so I can’t seem to get enough air with my mouth closed…however, when I try sleeping with my mouth open I get such bad post nasal drip that I start choking. I’ve seen a pulmonologist who has sent me to an ENT. He started me on two different nose sprays which seem to clear me up a bit but I still have the same problems at night. It’s been 3 months and I just recently saw him again. He is now suggesting surgery to fix my septum (sp) and clear my breathing thru my nose. He is also going to remove my Uvula(sp). He isn’t going to do the big surgery where soft tissue is removed and so on. I feel pretty confident in this doctor and he seems generally worried about allowing my sleep apnea to continue going untreated. Does anybody have any comments about this procedure…or stories about similar procedures they know about. thanks, Glenn

Response:

Hi all, I’ve been reading all of your comments and stories and I’m very glad I found this newgroup. I’m 36 male, overweight but no obese and suffer from severe OSA (about 60-80 times an hour). Unfortunatly I’ve had no success with the CPAP to date. I do keep trying as I know it’s the best way to get myself some rest. My problems are these….I have severe nasal breathing problems so I can’t seem to get enough air with my mouth closed…however, when I try sleeping with my mouth open I get such bad post nasal drip that I start choking. I’ve seen a pulmonologist who has sent me to an ENT. He started me on two different nose sprays which seem to clear me up a bit but I still have the same problems at night. It’s been 3 months and I just recently saw him again. He is now suggesting surgery to fix my septum (sp) and clear my breathing thru my nose. He is also going to remove my Uvula(sp). He isn’t going to do the big surgery where soft tissue is removed and so on. I feel pretty confident in this doctor and he seems generally worried about allowing my sleep apnea to continue going untreated. Does anybody have any comments about this procedure…or stories about similar procedures they know about. thanks, Glenn

Response:

On Wed, 24 Dec 2003 23:06:53 GMT, Glenn wrote: >He is now suggesting surgery to fix my septum (sp) and clear my >breathing thru my nose. He is also going to remove my Uvula(sp).

If the breathing through the nose is messed up, definitely get that fixed. I’ve run into people who cussed the recovery, but I can’t remember anyone who had any major complaints in the long term. The major effect of uvula removal is that the surgeon upgrades his Lexus to the next more expensive model. Other effects can include voice changes and having fluid fly out your nose when you drink.

Response:

relief from sinus trouble!!

admin — Thu, 10 Apr 2003 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Relief from Sinus Trouble Sinus problems involving congestion is the most common health problem in adults. The pain from the infection is sometimes intolerable and the pressure can bring on headaches and even toothaches. Many doctors recommend sinus surgery to promote drainage. The problem often persists even after surgery. GOOD NEWS—AS THE RESULT OF A MEDICAL BREAKTHROUGH There is hope of cure or a great improvement without medication. A body dysfunction which causes the sinus problems has been identified and is easily corrected. A simple painless temporary test is first performed. The results are dramatic in a vast majority of patients. Most patients will experience relief within minutes. Based on the test, a permanent painless, non-surgical treatment to correct the body dysfunction is performed. Worldwide, over one million people have been successfully treated by this procedure. This truly is great news for people who suffer from sinus trouble. ACT NOW and order the information package which includes everything you will need to know and the next steps you need to take so you may obtain great improvement or a cure of your sinus trouble. Go to www.medical-breakthrough.net to order

Response:

Forwarded with full headers to ab…@supernews.com and ab…@charter.net (Commercial ad spamming medical support group) ======================================================================== On Thu, 10 Apr 2003 15:08:59 -0700, "medical-breakthrough.net" wrote:

=========================================================================== =================== Path: text1.nnrp.aus1!firehose2!nntp4!nntp3.aus1.giganews.com!small1.nntp.aus1.gi ganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!cyclone1.gnilink.net!wn14feed!worldnet.att.net !128.230.129.106!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supern ews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "medical-breakthrough.net" Newsgroups: alt.support.sinusitis Subject: relief from sinus trouble!! Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 15:08:59 -0700 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Complaints-To: abuse@supernews.com Lines: 35 Xref: nntp3.aus1.giganews.com alt.support.sinusitis:35795 Relief from Sinus Trouble Sinus problems involving congestion is the most common health problem in adults. The pain from the infection is sometimes intolerable and the pressure can bring on headaches and even toothaches. Many doctors recommend sinus surgery to promote drainage. The problem often persists even after surgery. GOOD NEWS—AS THE RESULT OF A MEDICAL BREAKTHROUGH There is hope of cure or a great improvement without medication. A body dysfunction which causes the sinus problems has been identified and is easily corrected. A simple painless temporary test is first performed. The results are dramatic in a vast majority of patients. Most patients will experience relief within minutes. Based on the test, a permanent painless, non-surgical treatment to correct the body dysfunction is performed. Worldwide, over one million people have been successfully treated by this procedure. This truly is great news for people who suffer from sinus trouble. ACT NOW and order the information package which includes everything you will need to know and the next steps you need to take so you may obtain great improvement or a cure of your sinus trouble. Go to www.medical-breakthrough.net to order

Response:

Walt–A Question

admin — Fri, 23 Aug 2002 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Wow, what a coincidence, huh!? — DeLores Wilson Hillsboro, OR – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – She already met him. There were only 4 new faculty this year, so they saw a lot of each other. I’ll have Wendy tell him that we gave you a good progress report. The culture shock doesn’t seem too bad. LOL Walt My daughter and her family got moved from Oregon to Silver Springs, MD and her husband also is in the new faculty orientation at Gallaudet. He is the new sociology professor there so if Wendy meets Richard tell him his mother in law is checking up on him. That will totally confuse him! lol — DeLores Wilson Hillsboro, OR School starts for the kids on Monday so Wendy and I will be doing better soon. Actually, school started for Wendy 2 weeks ago. She has had two weeks of orientation as a new faculty member and is enjoying it so far. The commute is a little gruesome, but she’s getting used to it. — Walt Hanks, C.H.E.S. Conformity and uniformity are the twin mothers of mediocrity. Excellence is born of individuality and noncomformity.

Response:

She already met him. There were only 4 new faculty this year, so they saw a lot of each other. I’ll have Wendy tell him that we gave you a good progress report. The culture shock doesn’t seem too bad. LOL Walt – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My daughter and her family got moved from Oregon to Silver Springs, MD and her husband also is in the new faculty orientation at Gallaudet. He is the new sociology professor there so if Wendy meets Richard tell him his mother in law is checking up on him. That will totally confuse him! lol — DeLores Wilson Hillsboro, OR School starts for the kids on Monday so Wendy and I will be doing better soon. Actually, school started for Wendy 2 weeks ago. She has had two weeks of orientation as a new faculty member and is enjoying it so far. The commute is a little gruesome, but she’s getting used to it.

– Walt Hanks, C.H.E.S. Conformity and uniformity are the twin mothers of mediocrity. Excellence is born of individuality and noncomformity.

Response:

My daughter and her family got moved from Oregon to Silver Springs, MD and her husband also is in the new faculty orientation at Gallaudet. He is the new sociology professor there so if Wendy meets Richard tell him his mother in law is checking up on him. That will totally confuse him! lol — DeLores Wilson Hillsboro, OR – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – School starts for the kids on Monday so Wendy and I will be doing better soon. Actually, school started for Wendy 2 weeks ago. She has had two weeks of orientation as a new faculty member and is enjoying it so far. The commute is a little gruesome, but she’s getting used to it.

Response:

Walt, How did Amanda take the news of her diabetic condition, and how are things going with her? Also how are the rest of you doing; how are you doing? Gwen — Today’s great oak is yesterday’s nut that held its ground.

Response:

Amanda did better than I thought she would. She cried for about a half hour, then didn’t want to talk about it until the next day. By then she was ready to go and is self-monitoring her diet already. Well, at least she is self-monitoring the "can’t have" side. She still won’t eat fruits and vegetables. School starts for the kids on Monday so Wendy and I will be doing better soon. Actually, school started for Wendy 2 weeks ago. She has had two weeks of orientation as a new faculty member and is enjoying it so far. The commute is a little gruesome, but she’s getting used to it. Micah is being a teen. He is refusing most of his meds, saying they don’t do any good. But, he seems to be doing OK so I am not pushing it too hard. We’ll see how the first week or two of school go. He also just completed driver’s ed. HELP! I am doing OK except for a bad sore throat that is in its 9th day now. The strep test was negative and there is a virus going around that causes a week long sore throat, so I hope it will ease soon. The inflammation in my throat is so bad that I am having to take prednisone to be able to eat and sleep. If it isn’t better on Monday, I’ll call somebody. My PCP is out until September. Anyway, that’s the update Gwen. Thanks for asking! Walt Walt, How did Amanda take the news of her diabetic condition, and how are things going with her? Also how are the rest of you doing; how are you doing? Gwen — Today’s great oak is yesterday’s nut that held its ground.

– Walt Hanks, C.H.E.S. Conformity and uniformity are the twin mothers of mediocrity. Excellence is born of individuality and noncomformity.

Response:

Walt, my PCP has me on ten days of Zithromyacin for the sore throat thing. He says it’s going the rounds and is likely due to sinusitis – due to our prolonged drought. He also said he was automatically doing a ten day Z-treatment on any of his immune compromised or elderly patients. He took one look at my medical records from the RD’s office and put me on the Z. BTW – I took my first dosage of the mtx about an hour ago. How come I don’t feel better yet?

Response:

Smart Dr…….z pack’s work well for me but I have to take two of them back to back to totally cure the sinus infection (5 days rest inbetween packs) — Cyberhugs, DianeW

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Walt, my PCP has me on ten days of Zithromyacin for the sore throat thing. He says it’s going the rounds and is likely due to sinusitis – due to our prolonged drought. He also said he was automatically doing a ten day Z-treatment on any of his immune compromised or elderly patients. He took one look at my medical records from the RD’s office and put me on the Z. BTW – I took my first dosage of the mtx about an hour ago. How come I don’t feel better yet?

Response:

dry, swollen passageways

admin — Sun, 12 Aug 2001 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

I have had the same problem for 5 years. Recently went to a new ENT who didn’t really have a solution either. (I have rheumatoid arthritis and he suggested that my dry nose might in some way be related to Sjogren’s Disease – another autoimmune disease). I have had some relief recently when I went on Minocin for a flare up of my maxilary sinus which exploded my upper teeth – I have actually got moisture in my nose for the first time in 5 years! Don’t know how to explain that and will be interesting to see what happens when I quit the minocin. Am due for a CT next week to see what is causing my pain. My passages also feel swollen frequently – other allergists have shown me to be highly allergic to mold and dust mites and they blame that on my congested nose. This recent ENT has done a RAST test, so we shall see what that says. You might try a nose spray with grapefruit seed extract put out by Nutribiotic. I picked it up the other day in a Health Food Store – don’t know if the grapefruit does much, but it contains glycerine which seems to keep my nose moisturized much better than the saline sprays which seem to moisturize the nose for about 2 minutes before it goes back to being dry again. I’ve tried the Ringer Solution as well, but it doesn’t seem to do much to keep moisture in the nose either. Let me know if you find a miracle solution and I will let you know likewise! (Incidentally, I have not had sinus surgery and my problems are probably allergy related. Also, I do use Nasonex, which I seem to tolerate ok. Mark "cmcmorrow" wrote in message

news:3B76FFBE.4776B707@austin.rr.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Does anyone here have experience with chronically dry, swollen sinus > passageways? I have been diagnosed with non-allergic sinusitis/rhinitis, > and had sinus sugery 6 weeks ago. I feel like my mucous membranes do not > work well, in contrast to those people who have over-production of > mucous. Sprays like Nasacort/Nasabid/Nasonex etc.do not seem to have a > noticeable help, and I have read that they can cause irritation in some > patients. > I took the medication Accutane 6-7 years ago, which had the effect of > lessening the mucous secretion which causes acne. I have mentioned this > to a couple of ENT’s, but they didn’t seem to have any particular > knowledge of a connection. I use a humidifier in my room every night > which seems like it helps a little. I have even wondered of chemical, > dust, pollen, etc. sensitivity which would not have shown up in a > typical allergy test (since none did). > If anyone has any ideas, I would like to hear them. > Thanks, > CM

Response:

Does anyone here have experience with chronically dry, swollen sinus passageways? I have been diagnosed with non-allergic sinusitis/rhinitis, and had sinus sugery 6 weeks ago. I feel like my mucous membranes do not work well, in contrast to those people who have over-production of mucous. Sprays like Nasacort/Nasabid/Nasonex etc.do not seem to have a noticeable help, and I have read that they can cause irritation in some patients. I took the medication Accutane 6-7 years ago, which had the effect of lessening the mucous secretion which causes acne. I have mentioned this to a couple of ENT’s, but they didn’t seem to have any particular knowledge of a connection. I use a humidifier in my room every night which seems like it helps a little. I have even wondered of chemical, dust, pollen, etc. sensitivity which would not have shown up in a typical allergy test (since none did). If anyone has any ideas, I would like to hear them. Thanks, CM

Response:

Long term Bactoban usage, etc.

admin — Tue, 12 Jun 2001 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

In my practice we have not used Bactroban ointment for more than one month. It you need this for longer periods, probably requires a different approach to your problem. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.TinnitusRelief.net

Response:

When the nose is excessively dry, keeping it moist helps a great deal. Important to use moisturizer without preservatives. Try to secure a copy of Classification of Cilio- Inhibiting effects of Nasal Drugs by Paul Merkus in April Laryngoscope. He shows that most medications with preservative benzalkonium are cilio inhibitory and reports Locke-Ringer as best. Most of my patients with your history have benefitted by daily use of this as a spray. Also helpful, warm – hot compresses over the nose and sinus areas. Avoid fumes. Pulsatile irrigation to remove thick phlegm and encourage circulation. The suggestion that nothing can be done is not what we find in our patients. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.TinnitusRelief.net

Response:

What about long term Bactroban use? "ENTconsult" wrote in message

news:20010612234957.19064.00003477@ng-fi1.aol.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> When the nose is excessively dry, keeping it moist helps a great deal. > Important to use moisturizer without preservatives. Try to secure a copy of > Classification of Cilio- Inhibiting effects of Nasal Drugs by Paul Merkus in > April Laryngoscope. He shows that most medications with preservative > benzalkonium are cilio inhibitory and reports Locke-Ringer as best. > Most of my patients with your history have benefitted by daily use of this as a > spray. > Also helpful, warm – hot compresses over the nose and sinus areas. Avoid fumes. > Pulsatile irrigation to remove thick phlegm and encourage circulation. > The suggestion that nothing can be done is not what we find in our patients. > Murray Grossan, M.D. > http://www.ent-consult.com > http://www.TinnitusRelief.net

Response:

I’ve found that Bactroban used in saline irrigation (1 inch Bactroban in 8 oz. saline 2X/day) is effective in controlling my sinusitis. Does anyone know anything about long-term daily use of Bactroban? I think I remember the ENT telling me that there’s no risk of the bacteria building resistance to Bactroban because it works in a different way than "standard" antibiotics. On a related note, has anyone had success with grapefruit seed extract (specfically Nutribiotic GSE) in saline irrigation? One more question: I only have problems with my left sinus – is this normal or is it an indication of a specific problem? The left sinus is constantly geting dried out and then infection sets in. I don’t have a problem with congestion and my mucus usually doesn’t get yellow or green – fatigue is my primary symptom. I also smell a "rotting" smell inside my sinuses. I am especially prone to get an infection after vigorous excercise. As previously mentioned, I irrigate twice a day and used saline spray in between if I’m feeling dry. I saw an interesting suggestion on Dr. Grossan’s site that eating a food that causes excess mucus can help – milk does that for me, but I avoid it because all the sinus books say to avoid dairy. I might try a small glass of milk each day and see if that helps. I had FESS in 1997 and only recently learned that the surgeon removed a LOT of tissue, so I was wondering if I was suffering from Empty Nose Syndrome in my left sinus. My last visit was to the head of Otolaryncology at a major medical school and he said there was nothing that can be done to improve my condition.

Response:

Any good old home remedies?

admin — Sat, 30 Oct 1999 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Does anybody know of any home remedies? I don’t want surgery, medication, or doctors. I have really sensitive sinuses that get infected easily. I hate it! It’s gotten worse in the last year. The last week of May, I got a bad infection that led to a "wierd eye disease." It was so painful that I had to go to the emergency room! They said the infection somehow got into my eyes or tear duct or something… but it had never happened before! My eyes were stingy, dry feeling, and a bunch of yellow-gold slime was coming out and coating my eyelids and eyelashes. My vision was blurry, with fuzzy halos around lights. I used to just get infections after having a cold, but now it seems like I get them just from being outside when it’s dusty… Can anyone help? Hot/warm showers work very well at breaking it up, relaxing your muscles, and helping get over that generally "chilled" feeling. The only problem is, once you’re out of the shower, it all comes back. I don’t know if I have a fever, but my calves feel weak when I walk and my fingers feel weak typing this… I’m uncoordinated, my head hurts, and I’m exhausted. Can anyone help me? I don’t think it’s chronic because it usually goes away within a few days… I’m just worried because they’re more frequent. Is something wrong with me that’s decreasing my ability to fight infection?

Response:

Surgery would probably help you tremendously and might also prevent further damage and even worse problems. People can die if these sinus problems get into the brain. I’ve had this surgery twice and it isn’t all that bad. At least my sinuses are now open and draining. I no longer have the dry eyes, plugged up Eustachian tubes that affect hearing, the tight feeling in my head. I do feel that the skills of ENT doctors vary all over the place, so you need to search for a good one. The guy that really straightened me out with a second surgery was the guy trained at Mayo. Even the literature he gave me was from Mayo. So, if I were in doubt about who to let do it, I would probably go to the Mayo clinic. You didn’t really say if they’ve done cultures or CT scans to determine what’s wrong. Good luck, Wayne Dnonychus wrote in message

news:19991030192203.01254.00000392@ng-xb1.aol.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Does anybody know of any home remedies? I don’t want surgery, medication, or > doctors. I have really sensitive sinuses that get infected easily. I hate it! > It’s gotten worse in the last year. The last week of May, I got a bad > infection that led to a "wierd eye disease." It was so painful that I had to > go to the emergency room! They said the infection somehow got into my eyes or > tear duct or something… but it had never happened before! My eyes were > stingy, dry feeling, and a bunch of yellow-gold slime was coming out and > coating my eyelids and eyelashes. My vision was blurry, with fuzzy halos > around lights. I used to just get infections after having a cold, but now it > seems like I get them just from being outside when it’s dusty… Can anyone > help? Hot/warm showers work very well at breaking it up, relaxing your > muscles, and helping get over that generally "chilled" feeling. The only > problem is, once you’re out of the shower, it all comes back. I don’t know if > I have a fever, but my calves feel weak when I walk and my fingers feel weak > typing this… I’m uncoordinated, my head hurts, and I’m exhausted. Can > anyone help me? I don’t think it’s chronic because it usually goes away within > a few days… I’m just worried because they’re more frequent. Is something > wrong with me that’s decreasing my ability to fight infection?

Response:

Copenhagen d. 2/11-99 I’m a guy from scandinavia (Denmark) who have cronic sinusitis and are looking forward to a surgery like many others in Denmark. Our climate is cold and many people are due to sinus infections, allergies. A lot of people are using over the counter remedies, but offen with some side effecs. This year i heard about great house tip to prevent colds,sinus infection and indeed those who have cronic sinus or dry nose!!! It’s trick that has been done for many hundred years among the local fishers and it’s simple and it works!!!!!!! They using the saltwater to clean there nose (nose washing), because saltwater kills the bacterias in the nose and the small drains. It then prevent your nose to build up green/yellow mucous that causes the infections and kills the cilies. It’s a great ting to do after a sinus surgery to prevent a second surgery, because when your drains are clear the mild saltwater stimulates the cilies to move away the dust, pollen ….. It also creates a good PH climate in airways so the bacterias can’t survive. People who suffer from broncitis have told they can breath better when they do this trick, because dryness is some of the problem thats due to them. There are a lot of people who suffer from allergies, like dust and hayfewer. If they do this trick (nose washing) they allmost havn’t any problems even in the high pollen season ( And sometimes not using any kind of antihistamins). They do this in the morning, at lunch and at night. It takes about 3 min. to do. All you need is some body warm water from the tab, householding salt, A neti/nose can. You then mix about one teaspoon of salt to 0.5 L of water (0.9 % saltwater). You fill the can, and then let the water flush from one nose opening and to second one. You do this on both sides. After this you bend over and close one of the openings on your nose with a finger. Then "very carefully" blow out through your nose. Do this on both sides. The last thing is to turn your head from side to side to get all the water away (when your’e bending). That’s it… Now you been flushing away pollen, dust, air polution and any kind that causes infection or allergies. Good luck to all of you!!!!! If you don’t know what a neti / nose can is, you will find it on yahoo.com. Just search for " neti " There would be some online sales and illustrations how to perform this trick. Morten Villadsen If you have some questions mail me at morten.villad…@dk2net.dk

Response:

Seizures and Sinus Infection

admin — Fri, 04 Jun 1999 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

Yes Lulu, Tell us more about this remedy. Though it is well documented that other illnesses can cause seizures, isn’t it amazing how many doctors deny this? — at least in my case. Wayne

Response:

hi – i replied privately to robert about the remedy. i was saying that the "constitutional" varies from person to person. the homeopath goes through a hour long process of getting your medical history and other important info. before prescribing the remedy. so, even tho my boy’s "constitutional" remedy is sulphur, that may not be yours. also, the doc can recommend other remedies for particular illnesses in addition to the constitutional. she only gave us that because i was looking for a way to boost his immune system. if you’re interested, make sure you go to a homeopath with a good reputation. we were lucky to find this one, as she was also an MD and the insurance paid for the visits. but really, it was one of the best things we have done for our son, along with horseback riding therapy and swimming. (he has multiple disabilities) homeopathy is one of those alt.med topics that makes many people skeptical. i have no problem recommending it because of our good experiences. but the choice of doctor is very important. good luck! lulu – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Morris wrote in message <#va2o82r#GA.384@cpmsnbbsa02>… >Yes Lulu, >Tell us more about this remedy. Though it is well documented that other >illnesses can cause seizures, isn’t it amazing how many doctors deny >this? — at least in my case. >Wayne

Response:

HI Dara, Chances are, the remedy won’t work for you. Homeopathic remedies are fitted to the person as exactly as possible. Your best option is to go and see a homeopath. Lori Robert L. Sinnett wrote in article <37594810.F627D…@cpuinc.net>… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> lulu: > What was the homeopathic remedy? Thanks > Dara S

Response:

This is very interesting. My daughter has chronic sinus problems. It seems better when I use a vaporizer in her room at night. The sulpher is what was used to clear up my daughters fluid behind her ear at 3 years old. I read that allergies can contribute to chronic ear infections (which she also had) as well as the sinus problems. Once she received the sulpher treatment her seizures were greatly reduced for several years. Recently, I took her to the doctor’s because of a fever and I asked him to check her ears for a possible infection. He stated that at her age children didn’t usually get infections anymore (12) but her seizures had been worse lately, and sure enough she had an ear infection. He placed her on an antibiotic and the seizures lessened. When I discussed this with her neuro, he said the antibiotics probably raised the level of seizure meds in her system. But I know when her seizures become worse, there is something coming on, like a cold, etc. Michelle

Response:

lulu, Where do you live that MD’s are allowed to practice homeopathy and their usual stuff together? In Canada, if an MD is caught practicing anything else but, then they get to go through a long license-losing court case and lose their license. Lori – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> if you’re interested, make sure you go to a homeopath with a good > reputation. we were lucky to find this one, as she was also an MD and the > insurance paid for the visits. but really, it was one of the best things we > have done for our son, along with horseback riding therapy and swimming. > (he has multiple disabilities)

Response:

i live in san francisco. this MD has a thriving pediatric practice, and a homeopathic practice for all ages. she also runs homeopathic seminars and workshops. there is no problem with a medical doctor being a homeopathic doc also. the opposite would be a problem. if a homeopathic doc tried prescribing antibiotics or other drugs, etc., they would probably lose their license. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Lori wrote in message <01beb08a$e20c87c0$LocalHost@default>… >lulu, >Where do you live that MD’s are allowed to practice homeopathy and their >usual stuff together? In Canada, if an MD is caught practicing anything >else but, then they get to go through a long license-losing court case and >lose their license. >Lori >> if you’re interested, make sure you go to a homeopath with a good >> reputation. we were lucky to find this one, as she was also an MD and >the >> insurance paid for the visits. but really, it was one of the best things >we >> have done for our son, along with horseback riding therapy and swimming. >> (he has multiple disabilities)

Response:

Hi lulu, > the opposite would be a problem. if a homeopathic doc tried prescribing > antibiotics or other drugs, etc., they would probably lose their license.

I could see that, but I see no harm in the other way around. Canada’s medical association should get off their high horse and learn that there are other ways of helping people, and that medical and alternative therapies can work together. Lori

Response:

Isn’t it just amazing that neuros seem to know less about the causes of seizures than many other doctors. And of all the doctors, few of them have any understanding of these things. Yet anyone can get into the health literature and there it is. Since my original post under the "Morris" ID, my dad’s, I started running a slight temperature and discovered I had yet another sinus infection (green mucous tell tale signs). Sure enough I started having temporal seizures–not too bad because I’m on seizure medication. I got some antibiotics and once more the seizure subsided. I have now been through this cycle many times over the past few years and my goal must be to get rid of the sinus problem. In the "sinusitis" newsgroup, one of the prime contributors, Dr. Tichner, agreed with my recent statement there that my seizures could be caused by sinus infections. I believe that most doctors have difficulty with seizures as a cause, for they are told that seizures are caused by microscopic scar tissue in the brain–causing a focal point. Perhaps we will one day prove that this just isn’t the case–that actually nerves are irritated by abnormalities around the head and neck areas. This then causes a spasm, much like muscle spasms or trigger points are caused by irritated nerves.

Response:

wayne-pierce wrote: > Isn’t it just amazing that neuros seem to know less about the causes of > seizures than many other doctors. And of all the doctors, few of them have > any understanding of these things. Yet anyone can get into the health > literature and there it is.

Howdy! Maybe neuros seem to know less about the causes of seizures because neuros know more about seizure disorders! Sorta’ like a kid saying "Jimmy has red hair because his mother has red hair." While this may be so, the child has no comprehension of the intricacies of genetics and the probability of inherited traits. The less somebody knows about a subject, the more sure they are about their information. This holds true in just about any subject. As the proverb says: The first step on the road to wisdom is recognition of the vastness of your own ignorance! — David A. Naess URL: http://www.bigfoot.com/~dnaess e-mail: dna…@bigfoot.com

Response:

Thanks… I could not display your URL. Is there a problem there?

Response:

wayne-pierce wrote: > Thanks… > I could not display your URL. Is there a problem there?

Howdy ! Nope! I’m not aware of any problems If bigfoot doesn’t work try: http://www.frontiernet.net/~dnaess — David A. Naess URL: http://www.bigfoot.com/~dnaess e-mail: dna…@bigfoot.com

Response:

Hi Wayne. I don’t think it’s the Sinus Infection per se that’s bringing on the seizures. I think that any illness lowers the seizure threshold, and in your case it’s the sinus infections since they are repeated. Maybe you should see a good ENT doc and see if surgery is warranted. My nephew had tons of sinus infections and finally had surgery a couple of years ago. He’s been great ever since. They can also put you on a prophelactic antibiotic (that’s a daily dose of preventative antibiotic). I think you need to see a good specialist about getting the infections under control. Certainly an elevated temperature lowers your seizure threshold too.

Response:

diana…@aol.com (Diana350) wrote: >Hi Wayne. I don’t think it’s the Sinus Infection per se that’s bringing on the >seizures. I think that any illness lowers the seizure threshold, and in your >case it’s the sinus infections since they are repeated. >Maybe you should see a good ENT doc and see if surgery is warranted. My nephew >had tons of sinus infections and finally had surgery a couple of years ago. >He’s been great ever since. >They can also put you on a prophelactic antibiotic (that’s a daily dose of >preventative antibiotic). >I think you need to see a good specialist about getting the infections under >control. Certainly an elevated temperature lowers your seizure threshold too.

I would agree with most of this, but there is a caution. Sinus infections, improperly or incompletely treated, can lead to intracranial complications (such as brain abscess, pus collection in the subdural space, etc.), and these complications, some of them life-threatening, can cause seizures. If a patient with a sinus infection has a seizure, they should be seen by a doctor promptly. Best, Bob Robert A. Fink, M.D., FACS, P. C. 2500 Milvia Street Suite 222 Berkeley, California 94704-2636 USA Telephone: 510-849-2555 FAX: 510-849-2557 "Ex Tristitia Virtus"

Response:

lulu: What was the homeopathic remedy? Thanks Dara S – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -lulu wrote: > i have seen this same correlation in my son. but not ONLY sinus infections, > any flu will bring some seizures also. this is so well documented that our > new neurologist decided that having him on the lowest possible daily dose of > klonopin (1mg) is ok. > for times of sickness, when the seizure threshold is low, we have diastat > (rectal gel-valium). this has worked out very well, as our son’s learning > abilities increase on the lower dose of meds, yet we have a way to control > seizures when they do occur (multiple seizures – over 4 in a 90 minute > period). > about the cure for sinus infections, this jogged my memory. when our son > was on a homeopathic remedy (prescribed by his pediatrician) he went for a > whole year without getting sick. i took him to this doctor because he had > chronic sinus infections as a little toddler. the change was really > miraculous. now that you’ve reminded me, i think i will try that again. > she called the remedy "his constitutional" and it was supposed to generally > boost his immune function. it did. > lulu > Morris wrote in message … > >Over the past few years I have found a very good correlation between my > >sinus infections and my temporal seizure activity. Best way to get rid of > my > >seizures for awhile is to take antibiotics. After sinus surgery, my seizure > >activity dropped significantly, but I am still on seizure meds. However, > >whenever I start a sinus infection, here come the seizures. > > Note: Each time I suspect sinus infection, I verify this by taking my > >temperature. I always run a slight fever–just under 100 degrees. > >Any thoughts on this, or how to permanently get rid of my sinus infection > >permanently would be appreciated. My view right now is that once one has a > >sinus infection, it is with him forever. > >Thanks, Wayne

Response:

i have seen this same correlation in my son. but not ONLY sinus infections, any flu will bring some seizures also. this is so well documented that our new neurologist decided that having him on the lowest possible daily dose of klonopin (1mg) is ok. for times of sickness, when the seizure threshold is low, we have diastat (rectal gel-valium). this has worked out very well, as our son’s learning abilities increase on the lower dose of meds, yet we have a way to control seizures when they do occur (multiple seizures – over 4 in a 90 minute period). about the cure for sinus infections, this jogged my memory. when our son was on a homeopathic remedy (prescribed by his pediatrician) he went for a whole year without getting sick. i took him to this doctor because he had chronic sinus infections as a little toddler. the change was really miraculous. now that you’ve reminded me, i think i will try that again. she called the remedy "his constitutional" and it was supposed to generally boost his immune function. it did. lulu – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Morris wrote in message … >Over the past few years I have found a very good correlation between my >sinus infections and my temporal seizure activity. Best way to get rid of my >seizures for awhile is to take antibiotics. After sinus surgery, my seizure >activity dropped significantly, but I am still on seizure meds. However, >whenever I start a sinus infection, here come the seizures. > Note: Each time I suspect sinus infection, I verify this by taking my >temperature. I always run a slight fever–just under 100 degrees. >Any thoughts on this, or how to permanently get rid of my sinus infection >permanently would be appreciated. My view right now is that once one has a >sinus infection, it is with him forever. >Thanks, Wayne

Response:

Over the past few years I have found a very good correlation between my sinus infections and my temporal seizure activity. Best way to get rid of my seizures for awhile is to take antibiotics. After sinus surgery, my seizure activity dropped significantly, but I am still on seizure meds. However, whenever I start a sinus infection, here come the seizures. Note: Each time I suspect sinus infection, I verify this by taking my temperature. I always run a slight fever–just under 100 degrees. Any thoughts on this, or how to permanently get rid of my sinus infection permanently would be appreciated. My view right now is that once one has a sinus infection, it is with him forever. Thanks, Wayne

Response:

Sudafed use

admin — Sun, 08 Feb 1998 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -SorryHOLLIDAY wrote: > Mrgy1 wrote: > > Come to think of it, yes Sudafed gives me tachycardia too! Huh! Hadn’t > > connected the two until you mentioned it. > > Marge > Nice to know it’s not me. I just checked w/a pharmacist and he said > Sudafed (other decong. as well) was a sypatho-mimetic amine (wow, had to > ask the spelling on that one) and that it mimics adrenaline. Any > suggestions on what to use instead? Until then, I’ll have to use > Sudafed on caffiene-free days. June

Response:

HOLLIDAY wrote: > Does anyone who takes Sudafed experience Tachacardia (sp)? I’ve had my > heart race before when I was under a period of stress. Well, now that > life is just dandy, I noticed my heart starts racing after using Sudafed > for a couple of days. Thanks for the input.

Not only do I get tachycardia from Sudafed, but it triggers a genuine panic attack in me. I’m unusually sensitive to it, I guess. Even the children’s dose freaks me out. Once, just once, I made the mistake of taking both Sudafed and a cough medicine that also had pseudoephedrine in it, so I got a double dose! I ended up with a classic "amphetamine-type psychosis"–the sensation of ants crawling on my skin, etc. I called the Poison Control Center in a panic. They were quite familiar with the overstimulant side effects of Sudafed, and told me to drink warm milk and ride out the next few hours, after which the problem subsided. And, unfortunately, my nasal congestion returned too. But after that nightmare, I was happy for the stuffy nose…. — Steven D. Litvintchouk Email: s…@mitre.org Disclaimer: As far as I am aware, the opinions expressed herein are not those of my employer.

Response:

HOLLIDAY wrote: > Nice to know it’s not me. I just checked w/a pharmacist and he said > Sudafed (other decong. as well) was a sypatho-mimetic amine (wow, had to > ask the spelling on that one) and that it mimics adrenaline. Any > suggestions on what to use instead?

Topical decongestants (e.g., NeoSynephrine) are safer if you only use them for a few days. Beyond that, prescription steroid nasal sprays (e.g., Vancenase, Nasocort, Rhinocort) are a better choice. One physician told me that OTC "cold" remedies frequently combine an antihistamine (which has sedating side effects) with the pseudoephedrine (the active ingredient in Sudafed) in order to counteract the stimulating effect of pseudoephedrine. She recommended Tavist-D as one such drug–she said that despite the pseudoephedrine, it actually causes drowsiness due to the heavy dose of antihistamine. But OTC antihistamines can thicken mucus secretions and so are probably not good for sinusitis sufferers like me. In any event, I’ve had such bad experiences with pseudoephedrine that I’m not going to experiment with any more preparations that contain it. — Steven D. Litvintchouk Email: s…@mitre.org Disclaimer: As far as I am aware, the opinions expressed herein are not those of my employer.

Response:

Mrgy1 wrote in message <19980209023401.VAA16…@ladder02.news.aol.com>… >Come to think of it, yes Sudafed gives me tachycardia too! Huh! Hadn’t >connected the two until you mentioned it. >Marge

In my case, Sudafed causes heart palpitations. The pseudoephedrine seems to substantially increase the frequency of PVC’s, but no tachycardia. Regards, Michael M.

Response:

Does anyone who takes Sudafed experience Tachacardia (sp)? I’ve had my heart race before when I was under a period of stress. Well, now that life is just dandy, I noticed my heart starts racing after using Sudafed for a couple of days. Thanks for the input.

Response:

Come to think of it, yes Sudafed gives me tachycardia too! Huh! Hadn’t connected the two until you mentioned it. Marge

Response:

HI Yes I have my heart race after taking any decongestants. I was rushed to the hospital once when my heart rate went to 188. boy was I scared. It was narrowed down to the decongestants that I was taking. Makes my allergies all the worse not being able to take them. Now Im limited to taking only allergy drugs without them. Which in turns dries everything up making it hard to clear me up. I would consult my physician if I were you. Maybe they can give you something that will work..yet not cause your heart to race. Pammie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -HOLLIDAY wrote in message <34DE8062….@nep.net>… >Does anyone who takes Sudafed experience Tachacardia (sp)? I’ve had my >heart race before when I was under a period of stress. Well, now that >life is just dandy, I noticed my heart starts racing after using Sudafed >for a couple of days. Thanks for the input.

Response:

Mrgy1 wrote: > Come to think of it, yes Sudafed gives me tachycardia too! Huh! Hadn’t > connected the two until you mentioned it. > Marge

Nice to know it’s not me. I just checked w/a pharmacist and he said Sudafed (other decong. as well) was a sypatho-mimetic amine (wow, had to ask the spelling on that one) and that it mimics adrenaline. Any suggestions on what to use instead? Until then, I’ll have to use Sudafed on caffiene-free days.

Response:

Oral vs. IV Chelation

admin — Fri, 23 Jan 1998 00:00:00 +0000

Question:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – No results have ever been shown in any legitimate, placebo-controlled clinical study published in a peer-reviewed medical journal that hitting your thumb with a large hammer can have any beneficial effects whatsoever. And it can harm you as well ! Yes, but nobody charges thousands of dollars for hitting my thumb and then claims it will cure me of nearly every disease known to science. This is typical quack rhetoric, refusing to confront the rational premises on which scientific debate must be conducted. Anybody who has ever hit themselves with a hammer can provide empirical (although anecdotal) evidence that it hurts. The biomechanical mechanism which causes it to hurt is well understood and easily explained. However, nobody can claim they have been cured of a major illness by chelation therapy — or at least, there are no documented case studies, let alone large scale clinical trials, to verify that fact. Furthermore, the various proposed biochemical mechanisms which advocates of chelation therapy claim underlie its (undemonstrated) "effectiveness" have been demonstrated repeatedly to be spurious at best (documented in the article I posted). I am a visitor passing through from alt.support.sinusitis, where Mr. John Scudamore has recently made an obnoxious nuisance out of himself arguing in exactly the same fashion: ad hominem, anecdotal, and rehtorically evading the premises of rational debate (let alone the scientific method, which utterly eludes him). I thought I would check out this group since I noticed he was a regular contributor of baloney here too. Here’s what I think. I think there are two kinds of medicine: 1) scientific, based on proven therapies or therapies whose mechanism of action is understoof and for which proof of effectiveness is forthcoming (this does not exclude an "alternative" therapy a priori, but it excludes 90% of what is sold as "alternative" medicine, de facto 2) witchcraft with a mild dose of placebo effect, the bulk of so-called "alternative" (in fact, unproven and unlikely to be proven) medicine I am constantly amazed that the people who support this latter category want it both ways,all the time. If they are ignored by science they scream conspiracy and cover-up. If they are taken seriously by science and their pet theories are shown to be untenable, they claim discrimination or reject the scientific method after all. They claim that "allopathic" medicine is corrupt because it has a profit motive, but can’t respond to the charge that the $14 billion plus "alternative" market is saturated with hucksters and con artists, and has just as much of a profit motive without any regulatory standards to hold it in check. They claim that personal responsibility and "natural" healing are their watchwords, and yet all of their products and services are covered with disclaimers warning you to seek the advice of a *real* doctor and disclaiming any responsibility for the consequences of their b.s. if it harms you. They argue for an open mind, and yet theirs are as closed and dogmatic as one finds in any religious fundamentalism or orthodoxy. They make phony dichotmoies between "artificial" and "natural" substances and phenomena and yet they boast about how sophisticated their (artificial) techniques for preparing, administering, and marketing their "natural" products. They live in a universe of metaphors dressed up with the jargon of pseudo-science, preaching "informed" patients while spreading ignorance and faulty reasoning. Meanwhile, the real social cause of ensuring maximum access for the maximum number of people to the maximum number of scientifically proven health care options at minimum cost goes in the toilet because so many idiots are too busy worrying about their own chimerical "toxins" and "boosting their immune systems" and swallowing both literal and figurative garbage from the talk radio and the internet. The bottom line is this: in 100 years scientfic medicine has done for the human condition (in potentia for too many people still, but in realis for many hundreds of millions or even billions) what thousands of years of folklore and witchcraft couldn’t do. Without antibiotics, surgical anesthesia and antiseptic practices, public health policy, CT Scans and X-Rays, vaccines, insulin, genetics, etc. etc., most of us would not be here because our parents and their parents would have died of childhood diseases, dental infections, "natural" childbirth, and epidemic diseases. Those who reject science because it doesn’t have all the answers and can’t solve every problem and creates a few problems of its own and isn’t moving fast enough simply reject the only proven means for further improvement in the human condition. Without it we are nothing more than barbarians and beasts begging the gods for health. Aaron Fox

Well put Aaron ! (But geez, lighten up some, life is fleeting) Have a great day!

Response:

Oral chelation takes several months to have any measurable effect. For people whose health is reasonably good, it is a viable alternative. For those who have learned that they need chelation due to health problems, the IV form will produce results much more quickly. Waiting for oral chelation to take effect could be a mistake for that type of situation. William Kelley Eidem, author "The Doctor Who Cures Cancer"

Response:

Utter nonsense. No "chelation" therapy has ever been shown in any legitimate, placeb-controlled clinical study published in a peer-reviewed medical journal to have any beneficial effects whatsoever. And it can harm you. AF

No results have ever been shown in any legitimate, placebo-controlled clinical study published in a peer-reviewed medical journal that hitting your thumb with a large hammer can have any beneficial effects whatsoever. And it can harm you as well ! :-

Response:

Anyone have any thoughts on the comparative effectiveness of oral vs. IV chelation? My father is considering IV chelation, but I ran across an ad for an oral chelating formula that would be considerably less expensive. I would welcome informed opinions. Thank you.